Episode Notes:
In this episode, we head to Dakar to speak with Madji Sock, an insightful entrepreneur, investor, and ecosystem builder whose work bridges tradition and innovation across Senegal and beyond. Madji brings a grounded, fearless presence shaped by a childhood split between continents, a deep reverence for Senegalese culture, and a belief in the transformative power of women. From co-founding the Women’s Investment Club—now a model replicated across Africa— to leading her own investment studio, Haskè Ventures, Madji has championed new ways for women to build, invest, and lead on their own terms. In this conversation, she reflects on how local traditions like tontines inspired scalable investment vehicles, the power of women’s leadership in Senegal, and what it will take to move African ventures from “one to ten.
Episode Transcript:
Darren Isom:
Welcome to Dreaming in Color, a space for social change leaders of color to reflect on how their unique life experiences, personal and professional have prepared them to lead and drive the impact we all seek. I'm your host, Darren Isom.
This season we're traveling to the continent, to highlight African leaders and the continent's role as a key driver of global innovation and leadership. So join us as we travel across the continent from South Africa to Tunisia with stops in Kenya, Ethiopia, Nigeria, and Senegal along the way, celebrating the diaspora and all of its complexity and beautiful possibility.
This is Dreaming in Color: Africa. In this season, I'm lucky to have my Bridgespan colleague, Elisabeth Makumbi joining me as a guest co-host. Elisabeth is a social impact consultant and manager with Bridgespan Africa based in our Joburg office. With a background in law and a career rooted in systems change, she brings a sharp, strategic lens to some of the world's most complex challenges, from climate resilience, technical access to water, and sustainable finance.
Prior to joining Bridgespan, she worked at Pegasus Consulting, focusing on climate change and sustainable development across the continent. Elisabeth holds an LLM from Georgetown University, has a certificate in Systems Change in Social Impact from the UCT Graduate School of Business, and an LLB from the University of Pretoria. A Pan-African at heart, born in Zimbabwe with Ugandan and Kenyan heritage, she channels her expertise into supporting NGOs, like The Greater Cape Water Fund and CORE Africa, strengthening their governance and impact. At her core she's a purpose-driven advisor committed to building a more just and sustainable world. Welcome to Dreaming in Color, Elisabeth.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Thanks so much, Darren. So today, we are honored to sit with Madji Sock, entrepreneur, visionary, and co-founder of Senegal's Women Investment Club, a seasoned leader with deep roots in both global development and private entrepreneurship. Madji brings decades of experience spanning consulting, entrepreneurship and impact investment.
She's currently the managing director of Haskè Group, where she develops Senegal's policy documents in industrialization, research and innovation, and rapid entrepreneurship. Through Haskè Ventures, she has created companies in the health sector, agribusiness and more. Madji is also the co-founder and managing partner of the Women Investment Club, which was the first investment fund in Senegal and Côte d'Ivoire dedicated exclusively to women-led businesses.
Born in Senegal and raised partly abroad, Madji was instilled with a deep sense of cultural pride and civic responsibility. Her work, whether establishing a neighborhood coffee shop in Dakar or mobilizing millions in capital through WIC reflects a commitment to both honoring tradition and transforming systems. She is a fierce advocate for women's leadership, youth empowerment, and African-centered models of governance and growth.
Madji Sock, welcome to Dreaming in Color. And as you know, we're going to start today's discussion with a invocation.
Madji Sock:
Yes.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
It could be a song, a poem, anything that really rings true to you. And we'd love to know what's yours today.
Madji Sock:
And I had to think about this.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Good.
Madji Sock:
Because of the times we're in, and I go back to my faith right now. I say [Speaks in Wolof]. I say it a lot. [Speaks in Wolof] in Wolof means God is great, God is good. And with the way the world is troubled, all the difficulties that we're seeing around us, it's that faith, that deep faith that, to me is what I call on these days.
And in Wolof, because it's my native language and it's a language I feel that makes me closer to the people of Senegal that I'm surrounded by. And I don't say [Speaks in Wolof]. We joke around a lot with [Speaks in Wolof] in Senegal and elsewhere. [Speaks in Wolof] means God willing. Saying it with a lot more seriousness, say [Speaks in Wolof] is, yeah, God willing. So to me, faith, or others, it's a higher being, whatever it may be, that's what I call on these days.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And that's a perfect tone to set our conversation today. So Madji, we're going to start today with a bit of your personal background. So we understand you moved from the US with your family at the age of four and spent your formative years growing up there. But even while growing up in the US, it still sounds like your connection to the community and Senegal remains strong and true. So were there certain family traditions, values or lessons that were passed down that helped you stay rooted in Senegalese identity while growing up abroad?
Madji Sock:
So first I'll start by saying I am a mom of Babacar, who's three. I'm the daughter of Boubacar Sock and Aminata Som. So, Senegalese parents, their names say it all. And to me, that's important. My name is Madjiguene actually, or named Madjiguene. That's my full name. Jiguene means woman, mother, sister in Wolof, and Ma comes from Soma, which is my. So I think maybe without even realizing it, by selecting that name for me, my dad sent a message around being a woman and playing that role fully.
So I very much believe in women's causes. I want to promote what women are doing. I think that women are such a strong pillar in Senegal and beyond. So how do we make sure that women are heard and can engage in the right way and bring about their support, their contributions to all the development journey? So you'll hear throughout my story how that comes to play.
Yeah, so that's who I am. My parents, we grew up outside of Senegal. And indeed, we left when I was four. And always, they always spoke Wolof to us at home. We had Senegalese meals every day.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Oh, I love that.
Madji Sock:
We listened to Senegalese music. So to my parents, it was very important that we know where we're from. And I think maybe when you grow up outside of your country of birth or your parents have to leave the country where you're from, they will make extra efforts. They will go further to make sure that you know where you come from. So I think those were all things that were really important to them.
I grew up listening... I know every Youssou N'Dour song despite not being in Senegal. I can make a mean Thieboudienne despite not having learned to do that in Senegal. Shows up, for example, in the coffee shop I have and other places where I want to share those kinds of traditions that I grew up with. But also, my father used to work for UNICEF, so a strong believer in women's and girls' causes. So that was always a topic of conversation at the dinner table. And one of also, debate. Again, I speak a lot about, my father influenced me quite a bit.
My father was also radio. He worked in radio before we moved, in Senegal. And he used to run a show called Disa, where he would engage with agriculture, with smallholder farmers and with fishermen, et cetera, and very connected to Senegal, its history, its people. So also being from the journalist and from that world, debate and conversation was always encouraged, which is not usual necessarily in Senegalese society.
So I think also, that kind of upbringing and those kinds of tradition of openness, of you're a woman but you still need to do your part. You're still very important into this world. You need to show up were things that I grew up with and that have shaped me tremendously throughout the years.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
I mean, one of the things that I just deeply connected with was I'm half Kenyan, half Ugandan, but I was born in Zimbabwe, grew up in South Africa. So my parents had that job too, which was to make sure that I stayed connected to the roots. They struggled a bit more in terms of they had different languages and there was just a bit more contrasting journey in terms of how they were going to bring these two different cultures back into our home, but they tried their best.
Madji Sock:
Yes.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And one of the things that always landed with me was just making sure that when I do go back to these countries, there's something that I can give back. And that was my spark. And that leads us to our next question. Which is growing up, were there any moments or conversations that sparked your sense of responsibility to contribute to Senegal or the continent as a whole?
Madji Sock:
Yes. So I'm a firstborn. I think anyone from Senegal understands, or I think even Africa more broadly, the role that's bestowed upon a firstborn in an African family. How you have to be a model for the younger ones coming after you, how you have to care, et cetera. So almost what you... That's the role of a role model.
And I've struggled with it a bit sometimes. What you want to do and some of the things you'd like to try out as a younger person don't always fit that expectation. It's career choices, it's educational choices. I think if people had let me be, I would probably do something a lot more artistic. Yeah. So I think there's the role of being a first model that shaped that. But I also have to give credit where credit is due. Spending a lot of years in the US, how the ability to dream in that country and I hope the US don't lose that. The ability to be ambitious.
Somebody once told me, in almost any part of the world, you go and you say, "I want to move this building." People will go, "This person is crazy." In New York they'd be like, "Go for it. You can do it. If you do it like this," et cetera. So I think there's that special aspect of the US that drives entrepreneurship, that makes us feel comfortable with a blank piece of paper. And how do you start filling it up?
So I think that combined with this passion and this love for Senegal led me to come back and to work in that space, where a combination of consulting, entrepreneurship, problem-solving. Give me a blank piece of paper and I'm excited. I'll start drawing and next thing you know you'll be like, "What is this woman trying to say?"
But I think, yeah. So I think there's this calling from home that I got from this upbringing for sure I'd come back and do something in Senegal. But I think also, combined with what I took from the US, that ability to dream and have ambition and build and try. And it's okay if it doesn't work. And launch or start. It's okay if it's not perfect yet. Start and learn and continue to progress from there.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
That's really beautiful. And I also want to take your cue because I wanted to shift into more of the ventures that you've started along the way. So you founded and led the Women's Investment Club in Senegal, really to aim to change the economic landscape for women in Africa.
Madji Sock:
Yes.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Please tell us more about the agenda. What is it?
Madji Sock:
Yes, yes. So I'm very proud of WIC. It's a combination of things. One, I came and I was starting businesses. I started a coffee shop. I felt like I loved the patisseries of Dakar, but they're a bit too fancy. Sometimes you just want a regular coffee shop, your neighborhood coffee shops or you want a Starbucks, but you couldn't find many of those in Dakar. So that's how I started Layu, which is a coffee shop here.
As I'm trying to build this business, I also have the consulting firm, I'm realizing how hard it is for me to get access to capital. Getting a small loan or a line of credit from the bank is quite a journey, I mean, what they ask for. And I think certain things were perhaps harder to get, harder to justify because I'm a woman. At least that was part of my explanation. It doesn't explain it fully, but part of it. So there was that aspect.
Also, there's women have these groups that come together, what we call tontine. People have them within families, in offices, in all sorts of social groups where people bring their money together, and every month somebody takes it. And you've seen, I think every African country has some sort of a model. And once I sat with the women who were having their meeting, I was fascinated. It was total confusion. Yeah. But at the end somebody summarized and said, "So it's going to be this amount every month. This person collects it. This is how we're going to select who gets it." And I was like, "How did that happen?"
And it made me reflect on how when women come together, they have their own ways, their own approaches. It might look messy. It's not codified in the ways we perhaps are used to, but it works, it works. And to me there was a question of, well, I had also made small investment and I had heard of other friends who had made small investments into other businesses, but it was hard for those businesses to more or less formalize those investments. So you wouldn't hear regularly or you wouldn't know what happened to your investment.
So it's a combination of these things where I said, "Okay, so if we bring women together, still in the principle of bringing each a little bit to the pot and then it's something bigger for somebody to do something with, let's apply that to entrepreneurship. We have all these women entrepreneurs who need capital, are starting to understand what it means to take an equity investment and are comfortable with it. And there's a modern way of doing this. How can we combine the two?" And that's how WIC was born.
So it was calling some friends, we became the co-founders, four of us. And built this over, I think a little over a year where it was, "How do we take something traditional around doing communities together to do something? How do you bring that with the legal framework?" Because it is money you are taking people's money. "How do you go to the regulator to make sure you are not breaking any rules?" And that's how WIC is born. And today, it has invested about 5 million US dollars.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Wow.
Madji Sock:
And two of the WIC members are in the process of raising another fund for $25 million. Côte d'Ivoire has joined Senegal. Rwanda is looking to build the same. Benin built the same, leveraging what we've done in Senegal. And we get questions and comments from people all over the continent.
So yeah, when you look at our traditions and ways of doing things, they make sense. We got to 99 members without doing any publicity. I know five, I tell them. They'll know five. And because we trust each other, we understand that we're trying to make money, go further along, people join. 99, no publicity. We didn't have to go and aggressively recruit. Everybody understood what we were trying to do, but was also very happy that we're bringing it into the modern world.
And yeah, today I'm very excited to see an organization that I helped put together that's without me now. I'm just a member, no longer in the governance or anything, and see this thing. I'll call it just grow wings and have all sorts of ambitions and look beyond Senegal. I'm very proud of that.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
When you started the conversation, I was thinking about stokvels is what we call them in South Africa. Really based on the same premise of if you help the woman, you help the household. And just being able to really perpetuate all the goodness that can come from it. But as you developed on, I realized this is much bigger than a stokvel.
Madji Sock:
But you know what? I don't know if you know Wendy Luhabe from South Africa. She co-founded WIPHOLD in South Africa, and they are leveraging the Johannesburg Stock Exchange to help women come together, et cetera and make those investments. She came to Senegal to tell us about that model.
At some point we had accumulated funds and we were trying to structure this and do something. She said, "You women of Senegal, look at the history we have in South Africa, what we've been through. We were able to set this up. Nothing is holding you. Figure something out and get started." That's how we said, "Okay, let's go and talk to the stock exchange here. Let's see what..."
It's not the same one as in South Africa. We tried to put something together and we got started. Also, the power of connection between African countries, African experiences that we can relate to and somebody says, "Hey, come on, nothing is holding you back. Get started." Yeah.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
But that you took that leap is so incredibly admirable. With that, I also wanted to understand, are there other ways that women, and particularly when you're thinking about redefining business leadership, that we can learn from and apply today?
Madji Sock:
Yeah, yeah. Recently, I didn't think these were things even I would ever have to question, but I became a mom very recently. But I'm somebody, who for the best part of my career, I've been just working. I work very hard in terms of when I set up a business or if somebody asks me to work on something, I will put all my energy into it.
And there was almost this feeling that that's what I'm meant to do for anything I engage in. And not too long ago somebody asked me, "Well, do you think that the fact that you became a mom is going to slow you down or is going to have an impact on this thing you're trying to build?" For a second you're like... Well, first, I never expected that question. I don't see it because I say this child makes me whole, brings something. And women should have the choice to have, not to have. The choice is just too important.
But I never thought that at my age, I would be asking myself those questions of leading as a woman and never leading as a mom. I think some other aspects, like walking into a room and you're the only woman, maybe too many years have gone by, I don't see it or feel it anymore. So I don't feel at all that that's a challenge. But I also have to say Senegal is odd in that way. When I moved back in 2008, it's men around me who were really encouraging me. "I'm so glad, our sister, you've come back and let me connect you." I've had many men who were cheerleaders, so I didn't feel like being a woman leading in Senegal was something that was holding me back or that was a challenge. And it was more so in the US actually than in Senegal, interestingly.
Yeah, so we have our challenges around leadership and women's role in leadership, but I think also we've grown with strong mother figures. In Senegal, traditionally, women make a lot of the decisions in the background, know how to do it so that nobody else, or men don't feel so hurt or they're not in their right position. So I think a lot of men in Senegal don't necessarily feel threatened by a woman leader.
We've had women prime ministers. You look at financial institutions in Senegal. I'm always surprised how many of them are led by women. So yeah, leading as a woman in Senegal, I haven't seen as many challenges. And where they are, you can try to solve them and bring people along. So maybe that's where the hope and the not feeling like it's such an issue is.
Yeah, so women in leadership, I'm still trying to reassess it at this stage, what that means and because my life also hasn't followed a standard formula at all. So I perhaps deal with some things at different stages of life or that, yeah, maybe that's also why.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
It's so interesting because when we think about the narratives that often come out of woman leadership, we often are hearing the same things, which is, "We don't have a seat at the table. It's very difficult. We have to be loud and boisterous." And it's almost like a persona you need to take on, or a male energy in order to really fit into the space. But instead you shared with us a story of you were yourself. And actually, the people that were at the table were like, "Please come and sit with us."
Madji Sock:
Yes, yes, yes.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And that's a beautiful narrative to share with people that there is this possibility. And Senegal can almost be that blueprint to really showcase that, that world exists and it can be there.
Madji Sock:
Yes, and Senegal needs to be careful not to lose that.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Exactly. Exactly.
Madji Sock:
Because in the last few years, we've maybe had a bit of a struggle with that. I think because women want more, some of the laws and regulations that have governed us to be updated. Maybe, I think there's... We have to be careful not to lose that. I remember when I moved from the US and we had all these women platforms, et cetera, where I worked in the US and I would try to create that at the office. And these young girls were not interested.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Sorry.
Madji Sock:
And I was like, "Why are you not interested? This is so important."
Elisabeth Makumbi:
This is material.
Madji Sock:
They don't need it. They don't need it. If they do, they'll set it up. So there, there were these lessons around where we think women's leadership is an issue. Might not be or it might not be where we think the issues are. Yeah, so it's interesting. People tell me also, I live in Dakar, I engage with people who have a certain view of the world and life, et cetera. Maybe I'm more open, I don't know. But when I observe, I do think women's leadership is present, is real. And Senegalese women will go and speak for themselves anyway, in certain group.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
As you said, you're having difficulty with it, but just in case you have a solution for it, how do we make sure that we are perpetuating this, that we keep making sure that future generations understand the absolute power it has? So if you can just maintain what you just said.
Madji Sock:
Yes, yes. I think it's just being themselves. I admire that in the younger generations today, men and women. I look at our young people and they are who they are. They don't try to be-
Elisabeth Makumbi:
They don't try to be anyone else.
Madji Sock:
No, they are who they are. I don't know if it's social media that has led people to not feel as intimidated by what's coming from the outside. I actually tell someone, "I don't know if it's COVID," where we're like, "Oh, everybody struggled with this, so maybe there's some things we need to stand on."
Elisabeth Makumbi:
There was a paradigm shift that happened. Yeah.
Madji Sock:
Yes, yes. So I admire that in young people. So to me, it's just be authentic, be yourself. And the pride of who you are, the shoulders you're standing on, the history, the traditions that you come with, it's precious. And it's been maintained by people intentionally over many years, people like my father or my parents.
So take that and stand on it, stand on it very, very strongly with a lot of authenticity. And I do think young people today, they show up in that way. I am trying to find the English word. In French, we say complex, but they have zero of that. They are who they are.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
[inaudible 00:23:13].
Madji Sock:
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, so just keeping that and continuing to nurture and grow that is important.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
That is perfect because I work with a lot of young people. And I often just look across the room and just the audacity, but the beautiful audacity to be who you want to be.
Madji Sock:
Yes, I like that.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And when I look back, I thought I was that. And you meet the next generation and you're like, "Oh, no, actually, sorry.
Madji Sock:
Another level.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
There is another level to this.
Madji Sock:
Yes.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
So you've spoken about the importance of building an ecosystem that really enables African entrepreneurs to thrive. What does that enabling environment truly look like for African founders? And what's still in the way, or possibly what are the different opportunities that still exist, capture?
Madji Sock:
Yeah, so I think it's a very timely question for us. As a venture studio, we build companies. So we have a portfolio of 12. We know how to go from zero to one. We know how you go from not having anything to having a company that's actually functioning.
The big question for us at the moment is how do you go from one to 10? So how do you have a company that's growing to become a champion, that's here to stay? Areas that we need to think about and focus more on from this one to 10. That includes governance, access to finance, operational excellency, our excellence and research and development. That's another one that we tend to not focus on a lot in, and particularly I say in Francophone Africa.
And so the question is how do you integrate those things in a company that exists? But how do you do it in an authentic way? How do we make sure that for example, a governance structure reflects the way we govern or the way we engage to do business? It's different. I don't know what it is. But in the same way for the Women's Investment Club, we go from a tontine concept of women coming together to building a investment vehicle for women. Same for governance.
How do we think about governance [foreign language 00:25:07]? How do we think what does operational excellence truly, truly mean to us in a way that's reasonable, where we're not going crazy over every single detail because our ecosystems are still growing? There are things we'd love to have and see, but there's a few more years of work, but it doesn't mean we can't already start dreaming, having the ambition and integrating and building the models that are right for us.
So to me, when I look at the entrepreneurial ecosystem, I say Senegal has done such a beautiful job in becoming... We were not on the map. When we used to look at investments in Africa, the startup ecosystem, it was South Africa, Kenya, Nigeria, Egypt, and then sometimes you would see Ghana appear. And now Senegal is always on that map. And we saw how that was being built. We saw how it happened.
And now engaging in entrepreneurship is something that's understood, that's respected in a formal way. And I'm not talking about trade, I'm talking about entrepreneurship. So, beautiful job there. Now I think the question is how do we go from one to 10? And that's where in my view, African entrepreneurs need to build models, operational models.
So not necessarily the product, service that we're good at. But how do you sustain it? How do you grow it? How do you expand it to other countries? This is where we have to start thinking about what the entrepreneurial ecosystem wants. And I think this is even when we can bring policymakers to decide in the right way, what is going to increase trade between African countries? What is going to increase innovation? The whole talk about artificial intelligence, what does it even mean to us? So I think there's keeping to the theme of remaining authentic, I think we have to think about authenticity in all of those aspects.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Madji, you said governance and you took me back in time. I'm a lawyer by training. And I spent a lot of my formative years registering companies, helping them to comply by having three directors that meet every quarter and they have their notices and everything set up and minutes filed.
But just listening to you speak, I also remember finding that quite redundant. And you're right, there is a model that can be explored there. That we can push past that boundary of, "Let's just follow the regulatory law," but actually think about what can help our companies to grow and expand and really become more Africa-centric. But I do recognize that's going to take time, money. And that's not one person, that's a community being able to do that.
Madji Sock:
Yeah, yeah.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And so Madji, for your last question, and this is going to be very up in the air, so wherever it takes you, please, let's see where you land. Maybe you could share something that you've seen in Senegal or elsewhere that gives you real hope of the possibility that exists on this continent. Sorry, I knew that was going to be the reaction.
Madji Sock:
The resilience and sense of hope that I see, definitely in young people in Senegal despite everything that's... Our country is going through some rough times right now. The world economy is not doing great, but we're definitely feeling it in Senegal as well. People are still getting up and building. People are still getting up and going to visit family or creating music and art.
So that hope that things will get better is something that gives me energy. These days, I think a lot again about legacy. It's almost I need to start preparing to pass the baton. And I say, "Yeah, there's a generation that I can hand this baton to that's going to do things their own way." I might be like, "No," but it's going to be their own way, but whatever we've started, they will take it to the next chapter and somebody else.
So that sense of hope, I think is just amazing. The resilience of Senegalese youth, I've seen young people with all sorts of trades. Try to build their own company, try to write their own stories. And I see them today, we engage, they talk about the journey, et cetera. And sometimes you don't even realize what they're going through and how hard it is. So I'm very, very excited about that.
However, there's definitely this sense of hope and resilience. I now want it to come to fruition in big ways. Senegal, it feels like we're constantly at the tipping point. Constantly, for so many years Senegal is right there. We're going to get to the tipping point and we're not there yet. So I would love to see more people, more sectors, more ideas cross that tipping point. So people to say, "The hope, the resilience, this is what it leads to."
So for me, yes, hope, resilience, but let's start to see us go hit that tipping point and see where it takes us. My belief is that when this country hits that tipping point, it's going to be an amazing, amazing place. And to me, amazing means I come from development space. So for me, access to health, access to education, people having opportunity, jobs, that's super important. And then people being able to be who they are and just live. Live. Yeah. So for me, that's how I think about the future.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Ms. Sock, thank you so much.
Madji Sock:
Thank you so much, Elisabeth.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Somewhere in between our conversation, "Am I looking in the mirror?" I want to say that again because am I looking in a mirror? This has been-
Madji Sock:
That's amazing.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
... absolutely breathtaking to me.
Madji Sock:
Thank you.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
And I've just learned so much.
Madji Sock:
Thank you.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
So, thank you so much for your time.
Madji Sock:
Thank you. I've loved the conversation.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Everything.
Madji Sock:
Thank you for giving us a chance to tell our stories and for putting a spotlight on Senegal. I'm so excited that you guys picked to come here. So, thank you.
Elisabeth Makumbi:
Madji's journey is not just the story of leadership and innovation. It illustrates how we don't need to look outside ourselves or our cultures to find solutions. They're already here, embedded in tradition, strengthened by community and ignited by purpose.
And I'll be honest, at one point during our recording, I found myself quietly think quite loudly, asking, "Am I looking in a mirror?" because in so many ways I saw myself in Madji's story. I too have walked that fine line, sometimes triumphantly, sometimes learning the hard way between consulting and social entrepreneurship.
As an overly ambitious, somewhat naive 20-something-year-old desperate to change the world, I shifted from law to development and stumbled into scattered opportunities to support NGOs. Each of these moments taught me something essential, that hard work isn't about the number of hours you put in, but about intention and passion. Without either, your cup runs empty and when it does, you can't pour into others, let alone yourself. Every step of that journey has left me with lessons I now carry with care and intention. And so I deeply adore Madji's resilience through each of her own steps as I walk slowly but with certainty behind her.
We then spoke about good governance. And I'm still asking myself, what does an African boardroom look like? And more importantly, what does it feel like? One that is not only functional, but culturally resonant. One that makes space for how we as Africans make decisions that are grounded in trust, relationships and long-view wisdom. And then there's the next generation. We spoke deeply about their energy and their boldness and at times the audacity, which made us a bit uneasy. Perhaps that's actually the point because that same audacity is what makes them powerful. It's what will drive them to shape systems we can only begin to imagine.
If Madji's voice, her story or even just her way of being spoke to you, share this episode. Pass it on to someone who needs to be reminded that being rooted and being visionary aren't opposites. They're part of the same journey. So until next time, keep reflecting, keep building and above all, keep dreaming in color.
Darren Isom:
Once again, we put some music with the magic, collecting the theme songs from our season's guests and collaborators to create a Spotify playlist for our listeners to enjoy. Find it on Spotify under Dreaming in Color: The Continent.
Thanks for listening to Dreaming in Color. A special shout-out to all the folks who make the magic happen. From Africa InSight Communications, our wonderful producers, Mudzithe Phiri and Tom Kirkwood, production coordinator, Goddec Orimba, audio-visual editor, Omamo Giko, graphic designer, Ernest Chikuni and the amazing production crews on the ground in each country.
A huge shout-out to my Bridgespan production colleagues, Cora Daniels, my-ever brilliant partner in good trouble, and Elisabeth Makumbi, my Joburg-based season co-host. And of course, our fabulous creative director, Ami Diané. What a squad, y'all. Be sure to rate, subscribe, and review wherever you listen to podcasts. Catch you next time.
